Himanta Biswa Sarma interview | ‘No need to worry about reservation; PM has only strengthened it during a decade in power’

Before embarking on another day of hectic campaigning, Assam Chief Minister Himanta Biswa Sarma spoke to The Hindu on his party’s electoral prospects in Assam. He also hit out at Congress leader Priyanka Gandhi Vadra for alleging that Assam is under “mafia raj”, noting that she has not even won a municipal election. Edited excerpts:

What is your target for these Lok Sabha elections? Of the 14 seats in Assam, how many seats is the BJP hoping to win? 

We are working on a range of 11 to 13 seats, with 11 being the minimum and 13 being the maximum. I think Dhubri will be a difficult one. Our partner, Asom Gana Parishad, is contesting there. But that seat, politically and realistically speaking, will be difficult for us. That seat is not with us since 1971. They always elect Congress or AIUDF [All India United Democratic Front]. I am not calculating this seat.

It seems the contest in the Jorhat Lok Sabha seat, where the Congress’ Gaurav Gogoi is a candidate, has become a prestige battle.

It is not that. Jorhat is a stronghold of the BJP and right from 2014, the Jorhat seat is with us. Even at the height of the Citizenship Amendment Act (CAA) agitation, the people re-elected Topon Gogoi. So, it’s our stronghold and irrespective of any Congress candidate, I think the BJP will win with a handsome margin.

The National Register of Citizens (NRC) and the CAA were important factors in the 2019 Lok Sabha election. How important are they in 2024?

Neither the Opposition nor the ruling party is mentioning these two words. In nobody’s speech, you will get a mention of CAA and NRC. That is no longer in the political narrative of Assam. Whatever misinformation was carried out in the last five years, all that has been clarified and people are convinced that the CAA is not at all a factor and none [immigrants] is going to come [and settle down].

Your exchanges with AIUDF chief Badruddin Ajmal make for interesting headlines. But the Congress alleges that it’s all scripted and that you have a “secret understanding” with him.

Who will do a secret understanding with me? I am after seats. I want 13 seats [out of 14] in the Lok Sabha and 100 seats [out of 126] in the Assembly. So, who will do a secret understanding with me? You have to analyse that any secret understanding with me has to be a win-win for both the parties. I am here saying that we will not spare a single seat for anybody. So, who will do a secret understanding with me? Whoever has to do an understanding with me will do it openly. There is no space for secret understanding. 

Congress leader Priyanka Gandhi Vadra, while campaigning for Rakibul Hussain in Dhubri, made a very sharp attack against you and your government. She said there is “mafia raj” in Assam and claimed that the BJP’s “washing machine” was used to clean the charges against you.

Why discuss Priyanka Gandhi? Who is she?

She is a star campaigner of the Congress party.

But I don’t consider her. She has not even contested a municipal election till today. So why should we discuss about her? Because she is the daughter of a great family? We shouldn’t discuss too much about her. She has not even won a municipal election till date. Let her first establish her political credentials and then we can speak. We can discuss Rahul Gandhi as he is an MP at least. 

Ok then, the Congress has just announced Rahul Gandhi as a candidate from Rae Bareli. Will you be campaigning against him? 

That depends on my party. If they ask me to go, I will go. As you know, in the BJP, individual leaders hardly take decisions. It is always the party that takes decisions.

You are known as an election strategist for your party and many say that the BJP, including Prime Minister Narendra Modi, has raised issues like wealth redistribution and Muslim quota to bring out the party’s core voters after low turnout in the initial phases of voting. 

I think there was no low turnout. You have to go by the press release of the Election Commission in the first phase and there was a figure of one per cent over the previous election. As far as Assam is concerned, there was a higher percentage than [in the] last election. So, we have a certain philosophy and basic principles. In election time, we argue those principles and we are always against appeasement politics. Whether there was low turnout or high turnout, we are destined to speak certain things and we will go on speaking them.

One of these things is the Uniform Civil Code (UCC). The Prime Minister has said that he will implement the UCC in his third term. But our tribal communities are opposed to the UCC?

If you see the model Bill of the UCC in Uttarakhand, then that Bill has exempted the tribal communities from the UCC. So that debate has come to a rest. 

How is it uniform then?

Tribals have certain historical customs, traditions, and we need to protect them. These are not because of certain scriptures but a traditional way of living. We need to respect them and it cannot be compared with certain religious rituals that are not fundamental to that religion.

The BJP had given a call for “400 paar” but the Opposition has made that a campaign against you. The Congress says that such a tally will be used to change the Constitution and end reservations for SCs and STs.

Mr. Modi has been Prime Minister for the last 10 years. He has abolished Article 370 [of the Constitution]. He has done many landmark things but he has never touched reservation; rather, strengthened it. It is the Congress party that weakened the reservation system in the country. In the guise of OBC [other backward classes], they have brought in the Muslims. They are giving 4% Muslim reservation in Karnataka and in Andhra Pradesh. At whose cost? At the cost of the OBC people. They declared Muslims as OBC and created a duplicate OBC. The question is, why have they diluted reservations in Karnataka and Andhra Pradesh?

But Pasmanda Muslims are backward Muslims.

They cannot be. OBC has a defined class and it is derived out of the Hindu caste system. You have to have a Muslim census and can discuss certain other categories for Muslim deprived people. But [Scheduled Caste] SC, [Scheduled Tribe] ST, and OBC is a reflection of the Hindu caste system. When you are declaring Muslims as OBC, you are diluting the rights of the OBCs. If SC, ST, and OBC people are apprehensive, they have to be apprehensive of the Congress party. 

From a firebrand student leader to being a young turk in the Assam Congress in the early 2000s to becoming a poster boy of the BJP’s Hindutva politics. How do you view your political journey?

It has been a very satisfying journey. I have done what I wanted to do for the people of Assam and I am doing continuously without any break. God is kind.

Finally, you are not only very sharp in your language during campaigning but you literally dance at your public rallies. Do you think you connect with voters better?  

I don’t dance in every rally. There is a very nice song that the Assam BJP is promoting, akou ebaar Modi sarkar [Modi government once again]. The lyrics are very good and the tune is melodious. People want to dance and without it, my rally will not be completed until and unless I dance with our supporters. That song has created a kind of euphoria among people and we don’t dance in any other song.

So, will there be akou ebaar Modi sarkar? 

I think we are on our way to reaching that target and our numbers will be around 400 seats.