Andy Burnham’s suggestion that football fans should be allowed to drink in the stands again has split Independent readers, with some welcoming an end to unfair treatment and others warning it risks dragging the game back to its darkest days.
The prime minister has said the ban on alcohol in the stands at men’s matches, introduced by Margaret Thatcher’s government in 1985, is “unfair” when fans of other sports can drink in their seats.
But in a piece for The Independent, Lydia Spencer-Elliott argued that lifting it would leave women more vulnerable, pointing to record match-day incident figures and the rise in domestic abuse that follows England matches.
Many of you backed her. Several supporters said football’s history of hooliganism and tribalism sets it apart from rugby or cricket, with one insisting that nobody “wise, sane and sensible” wants to see booze return to the terraces.
Others pushed back. One season ticket holder described queueing 20 minutes for a pint only to down it before kick-off, while several readers argued that men who abuse will do so whether or not they can drink in their seats – and that most fans drink before and after the game anyway.
Here’s what you had to say:
We haven’t forgotten why it was removed
Nobody wise, sane and sensible wants to see booze return to the terraces; we haven’t forgotten why it was removed. Crowds are volatile and abusive enough sober! Booze back on the terraces will not improve the situation. And yes… I am a football supporter… big time.
I’ve watched rugby from the same seat with a beer
I’m a season ticket holder at a particular Premier League club and the way we’re treated compared to other sports is ridiculous.
Fans have to quickly finish a pint – having queued for 20 minutes to buy it – before rushing to their seats. There’s a mad rush to buy and finish a half-time pint before, again, another rush back to your seat.
It makes no sense in the modern world. Prior to games, away fans mingle with home fans at pubs throughout the city and I can’t recall seeing so much as a harsh word exchanged for eons. Civility reigns.
What makes it worse is that I’ve sat in the exact same seat of my team’s stadium and watched rugby while drinking beer.
Other sports don’t have football’s troubled history
I’m very dubious about having alcohol in the stands. It works just fine for most sports, but other sports don’t have the troubled history of violence and hooliganism, sometimes spilling over into other issues such as sectarianism, that has plagued football. The demographics of football supporters have changed since the ban was introduced, with more women and children attending matches, so maybe that will stop things sliding back into mayhem, but I’m still apprehensive.
Men who abuse will abuse
While I’m not much of a football fan (prefer rugby!), there definitely is something about watching from the stands with an actual pint in your hand.
Plus, men who abuse will abuse. It’s silly to think they’ll magically stop because they can’t get a pint for a couple of hours.
Football plays on tribal emotions
The writer is spot on. Football plays on tribal emotions. Alcohol makes it nastier. We all know that. A wound-up, tanked-up homecomer is no joke. Burnham has got it wrong. It’s a bit like asking an alcoholic to give up sherry before dinner. Naive in the extreme.
Treat people with respect and like adults
Treat people with respect and like adults. Football fans get talked “at” all the time. Other sports don’t have a problem with alcohol. Fans are low-hanging fruit that were treated like animals by the authorities and clubs in the Eighties. With the right processes in place, it will work.
I wouldn’t want to be drenched in beer
There are already bars in grounds selling booze during games; you just can’t take the drinks to your seats. So I’m not convinced that it’s any more dangerous. What I wouldn’t want, though, is to be drenched in beer every time my team scores.
Let’s debate abuse without add-ons
Abusive men abuse. No alcohol in football grounds means that those who are having a drink will drink before and after the game. If there is to be a debate on abuse, then let’s debate it without add-ons or we’re diluting a very serious problem.
If football is treated differently, ban alcohol across the piece
I am sure all, even those on the right of politics, will support the notion that women shouldn’t be subjected to abuse by drunken men. Apart from the issue around domestic violence, we need to ask whether there is a problem that some people can’t get through the afternoon without a shot of alcohol. My understanding is that A&E departments also see a huge rise in admissions following football games. That’s a cost on society as well as placing unnecessary stress on hospital staff and potentially delaying care to the sick. If there is a discrimination issue because football is treated differently to other sports, then ban alcohol across the piece.
Football is about passion, not tea and cakes
I get the point. They already have family areas, though. I’ve been taking my young daughters to Anfield for a while and would not want them to witness abuse etc. I think enforcing the whole ground to be “pleasant” is a bit much, though. Football is about passion, not tea and cakes. Children and polite ladies and gentlemen are not the key demographic in the stands for the men’s game for most of the stadium. Bans for people who are abusive are workable regardless of alcohol consumption. Next up, bans for people singing too loud? I think it’s a slippery slope to the gentrification of football. It still needs grit and character.
I’ve seen many black eyes and bruised lips
Well, it’s not only ladies that bear the brunt of loutish drunken behaviour, but having lived in Australia in the time of the six o’clock swill, knowing what my great-grandfather did when he came home on a Friday night having spent most of his 10 shillings on booze (this was 1880-ish), and being brought up living in pubs, I have seen many black eyes and bruised lips, including on my mother.
As a football fanatic who loved to have a beer or two during a match when I was in the stands, I absolutely enjoyed it, and it is a shame that just a few “sorts”, as always, spoil it for, I would suggest, the majority.
Not all men are wife-beating drunken louts. My good lady would come to matches with me and enjoy a couple of pints as well – she still does as I watch my team on the telly, but it’s usually a G&T these days.
On the one hand, I would plead for beer being served at matches, but on the other I understand completely this writer’s point of view.
After a match, they all go to the pub and get well oiled before they go home anyway, so is there going to be a difference if they have a few beers in the ground or outside it? Those sorts will behave the same.
In Germany, people drank in the stands with no issues
I think it’s a moot point, as people drink before and during the game, both in pubs and in the stadium before the game and at half time! However, this is a cultural problem, as I went to watch Bayern Munich in Germany a few years ago and people were drinking before and in the stands with no issues at all. This issue only appears to affect football, as it doesn’t happen at rugby or cricket games where, incidentally, opposing fans sit together!
The national domestic abuse helpline offers support for women on 0808 2000 247, or you can visit the Refuge website. There is a dedicated men’s advice line on 0808 8010 327. Those in the US can call the domestic violence hotline on 1-800-799-SAFE (7233). Other international helplines can be found via www.befrienders.org
Some of the comments have been edited for this article for brevity and clarity.
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