A nan told her son "you're a divvy" after he stabbed her in the heart, a jury was told today.
Jamie Dempsey is currently standing trial at Liverpool Crown Court accused of murdering his mother Karen, having knifed her in the chest while fighting with another man over a £2,000 drug debt outside the Brambles pub in Kirkby. The 32-year-old was called to give evidence from the witness box today, Thursday.
During his tearful testimony, he claimed he had previously been subjected to death threats from Brian Flynn - who was also stabbed at least five times during the incident in summer last year, suffering injuries including a punctured lung - over the unpaid cocaine money. Dempsey also turned to his family in the public gallery and told them he was "proper sorry" at one stage.
READ MORE: Murdered man was a 'beautiful personality with a gentle, loving soul'
Jurors had previously heard he had owed the debt to Mr Flynn. But the defendant told them this morning he in fact "owed one of his friends".
Dempsey described how he had been attacked previously by him at a nearby pub in March 2022 - by which time he had been "off cocaine for a few months", with the debt being "about a year old". On the stand, the dad-of-two said of this incident: "I'd never spoke to him in my life.
"He offered me a phone and said someone wants to speak to you. As I grabbed the phone, he punched me and put me on my back.
"Later on that night, I got a phone call off the person I owed the money to. Brian got on the phone and said if I didn't pay him next week, I'd be dead.
"I got rid of that phone and stopped going out. A couple of times I'd seen him from a distance and avoided him."
Dempsey said he did not pay up as he had "lost his job and was skint". On the night of his mum's death, he said that they would "just leave" if they saw Mr Flynn in the Brambles and added: "It was just a stupid idea to be honest with you.
"I don't know why I went there to be honest with you. I didn't know that's where he went all the time.
"I don't really know the man. I should have just kept away from there.
"I just said to my mum 'there's that lad there. I want to get off'.
"She said 'stay seated, I'll call us a taxi. I don't think he'll do anything while you're with all of us in the pub'.
"I didn't even realise he'd noticed I was there to be honest. We didn't know each other, the only time we'd seen each other was that one time outside the Tavern when I was pointed out to him by someone.
"I'd been in the pub that long, I thought he didn't actually know who I was. I just kept my view away from him.
"I can't remember much. I was hit on the side of the head.
"I remember jumping up and the fella grabbed me. I was bleeding from the head at first, then when the second glass was thrown I've put my hand up to block it and that hit my hand and cut my wrist."
Dempsey reported that Mr Flynn was "just shouting things at me - 'you cheeky bastard, watch what I'm going to do to you'". He added: "He's a big fella compared to me.
"He was like, 'I'm gonna kill you. Watch when I get you'.
"I was stressed, scared. I wanted to leave."
Dempsey said he could hear Mr Flynn continue shouting outside, saying: "I could hear him shouting stuff at the front of the pub. 'I'm going to get him, where is he?', stuff like that.
"I seen the knife at the side and I thought I'll show him the knife if he comes round. He'll be scared by that.
"I seen him and he's shouted over to me 'come on then you little d***head'. I started walking over to him.
"I said to him, I showed him the knife, 'I've got a knife here, f*** off'. He put his hands up at me, just came at me.
"I was already bleeding quite a bit by that point. I can't remember much of it at all.
"I was a bit disorientated to be honest with you. I remember getting grabbed from behind, I thought I was getting choked.
"I literally thought I was going to be seriously injured or killed. He was acting like a psychopath in the pub, and outside."
Asked when he realised his mum had become involved in the altercation, Dempsey tearfully said: "I didn't, not until after she showed me her chest. Then the fight had stopped really, I think I had my eyes closed for most of the fight.
"She just grabbed me and said 'Jamie you stabbed me'. I couldn't believe what I'd just seen, and that was about it.
"I said 'mum, I'm sorry'. She said 'you're just a divvy lad, it would happen to you'.
"I gave her a hug and she said to leave. She told me to leave and get away from there.
"I was a bit erratic. I was in shock to be honest with you, with what I'd done to my mum and to Brian.
"I didn't want to do any of it, I just wanted to get away from him. I regret it more than anything in the world, what I've done.
"She was my rock, she was the only person in the world that's been there all my life - my best friend to be honest with you.
"I loved her more than anything. Absolutely brilliant she was, best nan in the world."
Of the moment he was arrested on suspicion of murder, Dempsey said: "I actually thought it was Brian. When I'd left my mum, she was so strong.
"She told me it was nothing, she'd be alright. I thought it was Brian."
As Dempsey was led back to the dock following cross-examination, he turned to his family in the public gallery and said: "I'm sorry. Properly sorry."
Peter Glenser KC, prosecuting, told the court on Monday that the mum and son had been in the pub on the evening of August 22 2022 - as was Mr Flynn. Dempsey, of Brechin Road, owed a £2,000 cocaine debt and "there had been unpleasantness between them nearby before".
Shortly after 8pm Mr Flynn hurled a glass at him, hitting him in the head, before "following this up" with punches. He then picked up a second glass and again chucked it at Dempsey, who left via the back door.
Mr Flynn meanwhile was escorted out of the front exit onto Cherryfield Drive, where a second confrontation erupted. There, Dempsey repeatedly stabbed Mr Flynn before a third man and Ms Dempsey attempted to intervene.
The knife "made contact" with her chest at this point, leaving her with blood pouring down her dress. The fighting then ceased, at which point Dempsey hugged his mum and left the area.
She collapsed moments later, the knife having pierced her heart and liver. Ms Dempsey was rushed to Aintree Hospital, but was pronounced dead aged 55 at 9.45pm.
A "heavily bloodstained" Mr Flynn was located by police nearby. He too was taken to hospital after suffering serious injuries, the most serious wound being to his left armpit.
Dempsey, who is defended by Timothy Cray KC, denies murder. The trial, before Judge Dennis Watson KC, continues.
READ NEXT: Staff member stole £2,000 from Mustard & Co Bistro and Bar
Thug threatened to kill innocent man's dog and attacked him with a glass bottle
Fake Amazon delivery driver attacked man he wrongly thought was sex offender
Taxi driver bragged sleeping passenger had 'no clue' about sex assault
Armed siege pair cleared of robbery but face sentence for affray
