CHICAGO — Margot Douaihy reached Chicago's Lincoln Park in a roundabout way. She grew up in Scranton, Pennsylvania. She came from a religious family and a long line of clergy. She went to Catholic school, but as she got older, Douaihy felt distanced from the church. She was queer and in the closet. She moved to Massachusetts and became a poet. Several years ago, when she decided to tiptoe toward her love of mystery novels, she came up with a kind of homage to the hard-boiled detective thriller, with a twist: Her amateur sleuth was a queer badass nun. The book critiqued institutions, foregrounded sexuality and retained some lyricism, without losing the compulsive page-turning playfulness of a breezy read.
Its title, “Scorched Grace,” carried a dime-rack luridness, and its prose would set Dashiell Hammett’s Sam Spade or Robert B. Parker’s Spenser at ease: Douaihy’s suns don’t rise, they appear with a “slow simmer,” like “the swollen red of a mosquito bite.”
It was smart, fun, but the problem was, when her agent tried shopping the book to publishers, this nun thing stopped them: Douaihy’s Sister Holiday is two-fisted, chain-smoking, 33-year-old gay clergy with tattoos, deep faith and a seeming inability to find inner peace. “The church can be damaging to a lot of people, especially queer people,” Douaihy said, “yet it’s also an anchor and comforting for many of those same people. I wanted a mystery to make sense of that conflict. The genre can be surprisingly elastic.”
Gillian Flynn knows something about that.
The Lincoln Park-based novelist won the lottery a decade ago with “Gone Girl,” which also made bestsellers of her previous novels (“Sharp Objects,” “Dark Places”) and pushed her into writing and producing movies and TV. That said, “Gone Girl,” as a narrative, was no sure thing: It had more unreliable characters than reliable, and its whodunit is solved midway through. Still, it sold 20 million copies, redefined the genre, and, ever since, publishers have sought “the next ‘Gone Girl.’” Flynn herself, at 52, has yet to follow up.
But her name alone makes things happen today.
Literally. Douaihy’s “Scorched Grace” is the first title for Gillian Flynn Books, a new imprint by independent publisher Zando Projects — which also created Hillman Grad Books, an imprint for Lena Waithe, the Chicago screenwriter, producer, actress and creator of “The Chi.” The second Gillian Flynn Books title arrives in July, and more are coming. Not all will be mysteries. Still, a few enigmas persist. Such as, is Gillian Flynn more of a publisher and screenwriter now? And when is that next book coming? The following is a shortened version of a longer conversation with Flynn, edited for clarity and length.
Q: Why did you decide to do this? Publishing imprints run by well-known people tend to come off like vanity projects — though I guess they could be meaningful.
A: I felt the publishing market was hard to break into these days. Publishing houses are asking, "Where did this person come from? Is this sellable?" As opposed to, "Is this good?" I say that as someone at a traditional publishing house. But I understand it’s tricker now. My biggest interest is the voice of the writer, off-kilter books that might not find a hand in publishing now, which is much more particular about first-time writers than it was when I was a first-time writer. They want more assurance they have a hit. I’m constantly asking people what they’re reading, what’s unusual — the kinds of books just harder to publish today. We also benefit from a variety of voices once ignored by the industry, writers from around the world. It’s important a writer offers more than a popular Instagram account.
And I did this because (Zando founder) Molly Stern was behind it. She championed “Gone Girl” (when she was the publisher of Crown), which was not a typical approach to a mystery. She hung by me, she hired editors who know my tastes, so they basically funnel books to me they think I’ll appreciate. I have four more titles in various states of publishing now. Not necessarily mysteries — just books that deserve to be published.
Q: Yet publishers are still chasing the next “Gone Girl.” Ever think your success, however unintentionally, had some negative effects? You went to Catholic school in Kansas City: Is this imprint your way of doing penance for your crimes?
A: (Laughs) Oh, boy ... I don’t think so? My first two books weren’t blockbusters, and I got the third (“Gone Girl”) only after kind of auditioning several chapters for editors. It wasn’t usual. It was told by unlikable characters. At the time, if anything, I think it probably helped prove that you don’t need likable characters. In particular, you don’t need to write likable women. Incredibly, that was still being debated 11 years ago.
Q: Did you want the first book on Gillian Flynn Books to make a statement?
A: I was looking for a first book that just felt like a blast of oxygen. I was taking my time doing this. But Margot has a big voice. Margot appreciated the history (of the genre), but also she was flipping the noir into a new area on purpose. I don’t like when something is just trying to copy a vibe or genre and it doesn’t feel new itself. I liked her take. You see the history in there, but you also see her poetry background — some of her sentences are lyrical with a touch of darkness. Sister Holiday was different without being gimmicky — a queer ex-punk rocker nun who chain-smokes and believes in her faith and at the same time uses it the way a lot of people do, to get through hard stuff. A flawed narrator certainly appeals to me, and it reminded me of my first book, “Sharp Objects,” where a person is desperately fighting demons and figuring themselves out, but also there’s a mystery. That mystery is the engine for a character study. I respond to stuff like that.
Q: Are you acquiring books with an eye on TV and film adaptations?
A: Absolutely not. That’s a bad way to do this. I mean, that’s certainly a popular thing (in publishing) now, but that’s not a good thing. For a while, no one thought “Gone Girl” was filmable. There were a lot of disinterested agents and studios. And that was fine by me because I didn’t write it to be acquired — which is just a bad way to read or write a book.
Q: When your follow-up to “Gone Girl” eventually arrives, basically you’ll find yourself in a completely different publishing industry than you did in 2012.
A: Yes, and that’s scary as all (expletive). I am still grappling with the idea it won’t do as well as “Gone Girl” — it is a different world. I didn’t bother with social media back then. It barely felt like there were smartphones. I remember being sent photos of people reading “Gone Girl” — physical copies. That won’t be the same. I wish I had published (a follow-up) long ago. I had more freedom. How you write a novel has changed. How much do you acknowledge social media? I am not interested in interrupting a story so that a character can post on Twitter. But then, how realistic does the story still feel?
Q: You’re on TikTok?
A: Barely. Twitter, a little. But whenever I post, I get a lot of: “Please just finish the next book.”
Q: Why has it taken so long?
A: Because I enjoyed writing films. I wrote (the screenplay for) “Gone Girl,” then “Sharp Objects,” which I wrote a lot of. I did “Widows.” The series “Utopia” for Amazon. My dad was a film professor, so I have been as fluent in film as I was in reading. It was thrilling to be part of it and it was doing something different. I just got swept up. But you can’t do both (writing novels and film) at once. Studio deadlines don’t provide the same luxury as a publisher. Also, I had a year and a half of (pandemic) home schooling my children. That put me behind, too. At a certain point, I told my agents: “Don’t send me any offers. I am going to finish this book.” It’s nice to be back now. I love the collaborative side of film, but I am also enjoying being in charge of my own world, without having to read notes from studios or worry about budgets and locations. When I write, it’s entirely what I want.
Q: Is the book done?
A: The first draft. Now the fun begins. So no, it’s not done. I just don’t want to release a book to release it. I want it to be good. I know that sounds fake and author-y, but I don’t turn it in until it is exactly what I want. Until glitches are out, I am going to continue.
Q: You must relate to Harper Lee ... J.D. Salinger ...
A: Donna Tartt ... Yeah, I will be honest: I feel pressure every day to finish. It doesn’t come from the publisher. They have been extraordinarily patient. But when “Gone Girl” passed its 10-year anniversary, that scared the hell out of me. It’s been way too long. I want to resist that urge to just be done, but also I want to get rid of the Greek chorus on my shoulders asking: Is it too much like “Gone Girl?” Not enough like “Gone Girl?” “It’s not as good!” The comparisons will be inevitable, of course, but I still feel the pressure.
Q: I have a thing for artists who just release stuff, constantly. Like Neil Young. There are so many underrated Steven Soderbergh films it’s like its own genre.
A: Someone like Joyce Carol Oates.
Q: Right. They give a sense of: I’m just going to make things, I’m not going to question it too much, good stuff will be remembered and so what about the bad?
A: I admire that. It’s a great way to make art. I am never disappointed to spend a weekend in Joyce Carol Oates’ brain. But I don’t have that level of confidence. Maybe after the next book. I can name four or five Joyce Carol Oates books not considered her best, yet she wanted to say it, so she said it, then she moved on. I’m just not there yet.
