KEMI Badenoch has fumbled over whether Scotland is in a “voluntary union” whilst appearing on BBC Scotland’s Sunday Show.
The Tory leadership candidate entered a spat with presenter Martin Geissler over whether the Union was voluntary as she argued that a voluntary union was not “one where everybody can rush out at a particular point”.
She also appeared unable to defend her previous comments on “reprogramming devolution”, which she made during the Tory Party conference.
When asked if she believes the union to be a “voluntary union”, Badenoch (above) said: “Yes, yes I do – I think the independence referendum result in 2014 shows that.”
She continued: “But I do think that we need to stop talking about the union as if it's a union for Scotland or a union for Wales.
“It's a union for all of the countries and not enough is talked about the union in England, and I think that that's wrong.”
Geissler (below) then asked Badenoch what the democratic route out of a “voluntary union” would be, should Scotland decide it wanted to leave now.
“I think that's constantly having referenda is not necessarily delivering what people want,” she replied.
“A voluntary union doesn't mean something which people can just press a button at any point, and then it all unravels.
“There are many, many people who are involved, and it is a complex question.
“But if the real question you're asking me is, do I think we should have another referendum? I don't think the answer is yes.
“One of the things which I think we need to recognise is that building a country requires a lot of work. It requires a lot of effort, and it isn't something that we should take for granted.
“If all we're talking about is how to get out, we're not actually bringing people together.”
Geissler pushed: “But that means it’s not voluntary.”
“I disagree, I think that it is,” Badenoch responded.
“I disagree with the premise of the question, that a voluntary union is one where everybody can rush out at a particular point, people feel different things at different times.
“The union is about more than just Scotland or just Northern Ireland or just Wales. It is about all four of us, all four nations, how we interact.”
Badenoch was then asked whether the people of Scotland were theoretically being held in the union “against their will”.
“I do not think that the country has even healed from Brexit, let alone the 2014 independence referendum,” she replied.
“I want politicians to get out there and start fixing things for the people, rather than obsessing endlessly about these political questions that actually are not making life better for anyone.”
Badenoch also failed to back up her previous claim at the Tory Party conference that she would “reprogramme devolution” if she became leader.
Geissler accused Badenoch of not having a plan to achieve a “reprogramming”, saying: “You don’t know what you want to do.”
She responded: “I know that it’s not working. If something is not working, I can say I want to fix this.
“That doesn't mean that I've got a fully worked up plan, it means we're going to go away and get a plan.”
The next Conservative leader will be announced on November 2, with just Badenoch and Robert Jenrick left in the race.
