Tony, 64, Warminster
Occupation Retired entrepreneur
Voting record Usually Green or for an independent candidate, though has voted Conservative
Amuse bouche Campaigned in favour of Brexit in Frome. Everyone thought he was a Tory, but in fact, he’d been a member of the Green party since it was called the Ecology party (1985)
Alistair, 64, near Bath
Occupation Barrister and mediator
Voting record Labour voter and sometime member. Left when Blair went into Iraq; rejoined when Corbyn became leader; left again when Starmer took over
Amuse bouche Is a keen magnet-fisher
For starters
Tony He’s a very affable, likable chap. Communicative. Open-minded.
Alistair My first impression was he’s slightly alternative. He’s a self-made person, his political stances have been shaped by his experiences in the IT world. He’s voted all around the shop. Why the hell would you vote for Ukip?
Tony I’m not even sure that I did vote Ukip, now. I just know I would have if there’d been a candidate … The food was nice: Turkish, too much of it.
Alistair I started off with an aubergine salad. Then they put this chef’s platter in the middle of us, an overwhelming amount of food.
The big beef
Tony I voted leave, and Alistair was a firm remainer. I don’t think it’s delivered a great deal, but we only left two years ago. We were a member of the EU for many decades, so it will take time to find our feet and reap the benefits. Democracy is the big one and everything else follows from that. We both agreed the EU is not a democratic institution; it surprised me he would agree with me on that, but his take was that the UK isn’t democratic either, which doesn’t really take us anywhere.
Alistair He seemed to think that bringing power back to Britain was somehow going to empower us, but empower who? All it’s going to empower is the super-wealthy elite. He probably thinks I’m a conspiracy theorist, but I’m not. I think there was an agenda – the super-wealthy didn’t want to be restrained by new financial constraints brought in by the EU. It was sold to us as a pack of lies to the credulous British public, a referendum on immigration, which it was not.
Tony People are starting to get the idea that we’re running our own country now and the buck stops with the prime minister. The result will be a more dynamic and happy nation.
Alistair We’re just a struggling little country that’s diminishing in the eyes of the world. We have to get over the public school obsession that Britain is something great.
Sharing plate
Tony Alistair is very gloomy; his view is that we’re basically doomed, we’re going to destroy the environment. He thinks the planet will carry on but we’re screwed. If I thought like that, I’d be a very miserable person; I don’t know how he remains chirpy and cheerful.
Alistair We discussed climate change at length. To me nobody seems to be taking it seriously. Although he recognises that it’s a major issue, he has this blind faith that humanity will stop at the edge of the cliff and solve the problem with technology.
Tony I think we are saving ourselves already: a decade ago there was very little in the way of solar and wind power, and now it’s contributing 40-50% of our electricity.
Alistair Renewables was one point of agreement. But he still believes in economic growth and I don’t. I see it as analogous to a giant tumour. I’m filled with despair about the planet’s future, whereas he’s filled with optimism.
For afters
Tony The magic money tree was a fundamental difference. How can you just keep borrowing more money? You’ve got to pay interest on what you borrow. Eventually people will get the idea that the UK can’t pay its debts and they won’t lend to us any more.
Alistair I painted what I believe to be the truth: austerity is just a neoliberal ideology that’s destroyed our public services. He wasn’t on board with that at all, he favours what I regard as the incredibly naive Thatcherite doctrine: that balancing the books of an economy is the same as balancing the books in a household.
Takeaways
Tony We exchanged numbers and said, “Let’s get together sometime.” You could say we hit it off.
Alistair I found him a really interesting guy. He’s eclectic in his views.
Additional reporting: Kitty Drake
• Tony and Alistair ate at Cappadocia in Bath
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