Comedian Al Murray may be most famous for his mock xenophobic alter ego, but he's successfully stepped out from the Pub Landlord’s shadow to offer far more nuanced and thoughtful views on Britain’s place in history.
Al has an encyclopedic knowledge of the devastating events between 1939 to 1945 in particular, which he discusses in his twice-weekly podcast We Have Ways of Making You Talk. Alongside historian James Holland, the pair discuss all matters Second World War. The series has clocked over 500 episodes and counting.
But that's not all, as well as the podcast, Al has presented history programmes, written books on the subject and is now helping to launch a war video game.
The comic turned historian worked with games giant Sega to release the new Company of Heroes 3 video game - set in the Italian and North African theatres of WWII.
"I've just written about the campaigns in North Africa, and Jim, my podcasting partner, is just in the middle of writing about Italy, " he says. "So the idea of taking Calabria and fighting your way up to Cassino and Foggio is something I've been talking about for the last six months.
He adds: “To me, the Second World War is the most amazing historical event and subject you could ever study,” says Al. “And it’s one - where the consequences of which - more so than many other historic events - we’re living with still today.”
Al cites two examples. “The NHS is a direct result of what happened in the Second World War,” He explains: “During the war, the government needed to figure out what we were fighting for -so they commissioned the Beveridge report. This leads to the foundation of the National Health Service and the Welfare State. So the world we’re living - the NHS service that we went out two years ago and clapped on our doorsteps is a direct, direct, unequivocal product of the Second World War.
“And Russia’s attitudes to the rest of the world and perhaps to Ukraine are very much founded in their view of the Second World War. So modern events happening right now are a direct product of WWII.”
Around seven million Ukrainians and 14 million Russians perished during the Second World War, which in Russia is still remembered as the ‘Great Patriotic War’,.
“If you’re Russian, you’ve been brought up on the siege of Leningrad... in the 70s, the Soviet government pivoted historiographically to the Great Patriotic War as the justification of the Soviet State because they knew they couldn’t deliver the communist paradise on earth but what they had done is defeated Nazism. So for that, it was all worthwhile. Putin is riffing on a lot of that."
In Britain, our greatest WWII legacy reaches its 75th anniversary this July, and for the first time in its history, its workers are striking. Al says he feels “like most people that nurses striking is a last resort.”
Al says he won't say any more about politics. But he has said a lot about the failures of governance recently - through his Spitting Image puppets.
Idiots Assemble: Spitting Image Saves the World, a new stage adaption of the original ITV1 series, has just finished a successful run at The Birmingham Rep and hoping to transfer to the West End.
The production was written by Al alongside Sean Foley, who was behind The Play What I Wrote and impressionist Matt Forde.
The castlist of puppets includes Boris Johnson, Rishi Sunak, Keir Starmer and Angela Rayner.
On the show, Home Secretary Suella Braverman's hilarious puppet is possessed by an evil spirit and floats around in a long white Victorian nightdress.
Al chuckles as he explains that he and the other writers struggled with how to portray Suella due to the lack of an obvious physical impersonation.
“On the old Spitting Image, if they didn't have an impression of someone -they created one - so for example, John Major was painted grey, and Kenneth Baker was a slug.
"So with my co-writers Sean and Matt, we came up with the idea of doing Suella as a character from the Exorcist or some sort of haunted fairytale.
"Just as the puppets are grotesque so are the characterisations but the way the audience has responded, is just amazing because it is from three guys sitting around going, ‘oh God, what are we going to do about her?’”
Born Born Alastair James Hay Murray in Buckinghamshire, Al’s fascination with war history stems from his father Lt Col Ingram Murray, who served in the Parachute Squadron of the Royal Engineers. This led to a place at Oxford University to read Modern History. But after meeting fellow students and comics in the making Stuart Lee and Richard Herring, a new career path opened up.
“They were putting on a comedy show, and I asked them how I could that?” Al recalls. “I started doing sketches, and by the time I left university, it felt like something that I could feasibly do rather than a bizarre world that I knew nothing about. My biggest regret though is that I didn't make the most of studying. I should have less time in the pub.”
His big comedy break came working with Harry Hill - going on to play Harry’s brother Alan in TV burp, but it was as the beer-swilling publican that cemented his place in comic history.
As well as writing for the Spitting Image puppets, Al voices some of them too. “I do Tyson Fury - he’s my favourite puppet, and also Rupert Murdoch and Prince Andrew,” Al reveals.
The 54-year-old, who is related to Vanity Fair novelist William Makepeace Thackery, is father to two daughters, Willow, 19 and Scarlett, 23, from his ex-marriage to Amber Hargreaves.
Al is also a grandfather to Scarlett’s daughter Cassia. “I have always told my daughters that if you want to do well in life, get a stable job and become an accountant,” he says. “Comedy is a mad job.”
But making people think is as important to Al as making them laugh. He’s presented the History Channel series Why Does Everybody Hate The English and Why Do The Brits Win Every War on Sky History. His book Command: How the Allies Learned to Win the Second World War was published last year.
The Pub Landlord has not been retired - ‘The Guv’ returns to the stage at the Royal Albert Hall in May- but Al is clearly relishing using his profile to make history more mainstream.
The Company of Heroes game was launched with the help of carrier pigeons.
“80 years ago, the idea of smartphones to call anyone in the world would have been the wildest science fiction. Radio was only really just getting established and working properly. But stick a message on a pigeon, it will go where you want it to go, very reliable. So why not use that?”
Between 1943 and 1949, this was such a reliable form of communication across the battlefield that a total of 32 pigeons were awarded medals in recognition for the part they played in the Allied War effort.
In popular culture, the vital work of feathered messengers was depicted in HBO fantasy drama Game of Thrones.
“The ravens used to send messages across Westeres are essentially homing pigeons," says Al, a GoT fan, "but pigeons don’t seem very glamorous today.”
Company of Heroes 3 WWII boots-on-the-ground storytelling makes it ripe for a screen adaption similar to another HBO series, Last of Us.
“When you play this game, you can see how it could be a movie or a TV series like Last of Us," Al says. “Strategy and military games are very much part of the sort of Second World War popular culture, but the trend really started with films - they are a point of entry into getting deeper into war history beyond what is taught in schools.
"What most people know about World War 2 is probably a Blitz spirit, a bit of Dunkirk and maybe D-Day, that’s it.” he says. “Certainly, younger listeners to We Have Ways of Making You Talk - are interested, thanks to Saving Private Ryan, thanks to Band of Brothers. For me, it was watching The Great Escape on rainy bank holidays.”
The comedian who is the author of 2013 Watching War Films with My Dad, was gratified to see the awards success of the remake of the phenomenal All Quiet On The Western Front WWI epic. “Anything that encourages people to widen their knowledge and understanding of history - whether it’s a video game, podcast, a book, film or TV show is a brilliant thing.”
Al Murray teamed up with SEGA to launch World War II strategy game Company of Heroes 3, available now on PC: For more information about Company of Heroes 3, head to www.companyofheroes.com or you can follow the game on YouTube, Twitter, Instagram and Facebook.
